Topic: "series" entity
Hi all,
A while back reosarevok started a thread on [mb-style] asking for input on a proposed "series" entity. Maybe some of the forum-regulars want to join in?
1 2012-09-18 06:02:48 (edited by caller#6 2012-09-18 06:03:59)
2 2012-09-18 18:12:10 (edited by Rovastar 2012-09-18 18:38:41)
Re: "series" entity
This is of interest as I have a lot of series in my collections but I don't see any details there of how this will work in the real world for real world series.
Many of these series are compilations often with various artists. For DJ mixed albums there are currently very little guidelines. (Titling the release: "Various Artists" versus the DJ mixer, etc)
Are these to be tightened up before advancing further on with the series group?
Is it to include the potential guidelines here: http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Part_Of_Ser … nship_Type
As ultimately improving Musicbrainz hopefully will increase my tagging options.
How will creating a series help/alter the tagging in Picard? What options will be available?
Say I wanted all the Ministry of Sound compilations under the folder/tagging structure Various artists/Ministry of Sound Series/<Album title> could I do that?
How are we handling more nested Series like Ministry of Sound:
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series/Ministry_Of_Sound
Ministry of Sound: Chillout Session
Ministry of Sound: The Annual
etc
Are they separate series or nested series of multiple series?
e.g. All under one overall Ministry of Sounds series but there are "Ministry of Sound: The Annual" etc series is a subset of this.
there are a fair few examples of nested/subsets like this"Best of" in other series for an example.
And back with MoS how do you handle all the "others" in that series page. One of releases under a the same label/series banner like: Ministry of Sound: Real Garage It is a "series" release of one. Is this a series or not? It is on the wiki link as a series under "others".
Re: "series" entity
Rovastar wrote:
... but I don't see any details there of how this will work in the real world for real world series ...
Is it to include the potential guidelines here: Part of Series Relationship?
No, the old "part of series" was a pre-NGS attempt to implement Series using only relationships between releases (or release groups).
The current discussion isn't a proposal yet. It's more of a brainstorming session. The idea is that as series would be a "thingy"*, and releases (or recordings or whatever) would be related to that one thingy, similar to how labels work.
How will creating a series help/alter the tagging in Picard? What options will be available?
I'd assume that once Picard is aware of Series, you could use Picard scripting to get your tags looking the way you want them to look.
How are we handling more nested Series like Ministry of Sound?
I haven't looked at that particular case. But that's exactly the purpose of reosarevok's thread, to ask editors what basic things a Series should be able to do. I'd encourage you to participate in the thread directly, either on nabble or on the mailing list, but for those of you who avoid [mb-style] I'll do my best to make sure comments in this forum thread are taken into account.
* I use "thingy" here in the most technical sense :-) A table in the db, an "object being represented", you know ... a "thingy". I need to get over my bad habit of calling them "entities".
4 2012-09-18 22:45:40 (edited by Rovastar 2012-09-18 23:15:51)
Re: "series" entity
The Part of Series guidelines talks about things like ordering the series and what to do when missing MB is missing releases in the series, that is what was getting at rather than the technical stuff in that wiki.
When considering Series I would look at the wiki page on it and see how we would implement them for these.
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series
I just picked out a large series at random, Ministry of Sound is one. Most are the same and have the similar problems.
I can look through that list and see other potential/repeated issues.
Pop compilation series Now Thats What I call Music
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series/Now_ … Call_Music
Has multiple types and many series with the same name (Now Thats What I call Music) for many different countries in the world on separate record labels.
And has additional problems within the sub series as it is a resurrected series of the same name in New Zealand.
New Zealand original series
New Zealand current series
But most/most have similar issues with the nesting/sub series.
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series/20th_Century_Masters
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series/Buddha-Bar
http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series/Cafe_Del_Mar
Some series are numbered, some or not. How are we ordering those chronologically? What about ones that are numbered and then have a "Best Of" halfway through the series?
Would the releases of the "Peel Sessions" (from the late BBC radio's veteran DJ John Peel) be a series?
http://musicbrainz.org/label/0c49508e-a … 6270589ae3 (mostly that label released Peel Sessions as you can see there is much confusion/lack of standards there already)
But not all released on that label (and what order do you put them in)
There were BBC sessions and there were hundreds/thousands of them
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Peel_sessions
Are they are series too? How do they link to the CD released series, if at all?
Are we linking series to releases or release groups?
For Cafe Del Mar series http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/Series/Cafe_Del_Mar
some releases in the series are different for each country. Different titles, and different running order and/or trac
Café del Mar, volumen siete (or "Volume Seven" for the US version)
Café del Mar, volumen ocho:
11-track UK version
12-track Brazilian version
13-track UK special edition
14-track US version
14-track Australian version
How do we handle this? A separate series for the Brazilian one when only 1 release of the 16 that separate series for each country even if just 1 release was different?
What about the UK 2 different versions of volume 8/ocho? Do they have 2 separate series for this case? What do we call them?
Anyway that is just me looking for a few minutes to get that. I didn't know most of them/level of complexity until I looked at the wiki. There are probably loads more special cases we we think about it.
/rant start
Personally I can't stand mailing lists. Email addresses laid bear to the world (I have been spammed to many times from archived mailing lists in the past), having to have permission to join each mailing list, Getting spammed about stuff when I don't want to contribute and then asking to be removed and if I did want to post back having to ask permission again to post, horrible interfaces (nabble has got better in recent times when it actually works and groups relevant messages together but even so) they are so 80's/90's. Forums are a vast improvement and the forums here has more activity too.....So hopefully some of the conversation will come here.
end rant/